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| AbroadPlanet Forums -> Brat-3: ACTR Students Community | Post new topic |
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08-Feb-2001 11:13 PM |
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Neo |
by the way... journalist was killed for that project
www.pravda.com.ua on svoey jiznyu zachitil pravo govorit' pravdu... [Brat 3: University of Pennsylvania I] |
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08-Feb-2001 11:32 PM |
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Tarasishe |
Ya tut podumav, a mozhe des v Ineti ye zapysy toyi plivky? Ya b ne proty posluhaty! Yaksho htos shos znaye , davayte dilitsa!
Taras [Brat 3: University of Pennsylvania I] |
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08-Feb-2001 11:47 PM |
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Neo |
of course! yest' zapisi!!!
prichem oni vse proshli ekspertizu v evrope... i Kuchma prakticheski sam priznal eto... dayu 2 versii: ukrainian i english. english dnya non-ukrainians =========================== English-language translation of the tape released by Oleksandr Moroz allegedly linking President Leonid Kuchma in the disappearance of journalist Georgy Gongadze: Episode 1 - Hello. - Hello. - You give me this same one at Ukrainska Pravda and ... we will start to decide what to do with him. He's simply gone too far already. - Started a case. - Wha-? - Started a case... (undecipherable) - Good - (undecipherable) - No, I don't necessarily need a case. ... Ukrainska Pravda, well, this is completely already, blyad, isnolence. Bastard, blya. The Georgian, Georgian, blin. - Gongadze, or what? - Gongadze. - Well, someone finances him... - Well, he actively works with this, with Moroz, with Grani (Web site). I will on Saturday him... with Matvienko. - Maybe people's deputies here to court, let the lawyers bring him to court. - This goes to the prosecutor, right? - No, Let Kravchenko... (undecipherable) - (undecipherable) - It's just, blya, ... there is some kind of limit, son-of-a-bitch, blya. ... - Deport him, bliat, to Georgia and throw him out there f*** him. - Drive him out to Georgia and throw him there. - the Chechens should steal him. ...<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com  fficeffice" />
Episode 2 - So that I don't forget, there's this one Gongadze... - I think I heard this kind of surname. - Well, bastard, blya, final limit - Gongadze. He already came our way somewhere... - Wha-? - He passed by somewhere. Looking for him. - That means, what he constantly writes in some kind of "Ukrainska some kind of Pravda", he pushes it into the Internet, understand. Well who, someone finances him - (undecipherable) - But the main thing he needs to be pushed back. Volodya says the Chechens should steal him and drive him to Chechnya to f*** himself and ask for a ransom. - Eh, we'll just somewhere him... - Eh, these sort of people (laughter) totally major... - Don't spread anything. - Well, and drive him out to Georgia, and that's it. - Meaning, in the first place, will we be giving (official) permission, not permission, that head of the rayon division..., oh, you remember, the one that in Chernihiv oblast said: "Let the president pay you " - Yeh-yeh-yeh. - They've already released the vice head. They started a criminal case against him. Meaning on 165 this is for official service violations, and 185. So I think that he's here. And this week we'll him - Yeh. Yeh. Let's - We'll also show who to say what to. Episode 3 - On Gongadze there is besides that that he works together with Moroz. - For Moroz he's been writing there in his Grani still from the very summer. How does he finance (?)... - Well, this is the type of garbage. I wouldn't be surprised that with them there with the socialists there are ties there. ... Well, we'll take care of things with them. I think this is... - There are outlines. This is Medvechuk and Surkis? - This is that there is a tie between them this is... - No, that's how once... - I remember this game near Kievskie Vedomosti (newspaper). Surkis, blya, why do we need a Jew, blya. - Come on, why do you need a Jew - And now I read some of those same conversations of theirs - Eh, it's he that posts them. That was there method then. And it still exists. They're creating a problem there, later, as if, they go to a person and help and later it turns out that that person is dependent on them. And it is in this way that they here... This is a big spectacle at such a level, I don't know, maybe, national. They played it out and it made hits... Eh, this is this kind of thing. ... And, this, maybe, is all. Episode 4 - I would like to ask you about this kind of form. I mean to use, so that I don't forget. - This Georgian. - I'm, we're working. - Meaning... - - I'm telling you, drive him out, throw out. Give him to the Chechens. (undecipherable) and then a ransom. - We'll think it over. We're do it in such a way, so that - Meaning drive him out, undress him, blya, leave him without his pants, let him sit there. - I'd do it simply, blya, they told me about it today. We're learning the situation: where he's walking, which ways he walks. We've got someone sitting there connected up. We have to study it just a little bit, we'll do it. The team I have is a fighting one, such eagles, everything you want, they'll do. Meaning this is the present. - For some reason you're not saying anything about Gongadze? - To stay quiet (undecipherable) - Honest. Well I'm reporting to you. There we made somewhat of a mistake. - There he's got a team headed by the last name they told me, blya. - Meaning he wrote a complaint to the general prosecutor. Well, I think... - Who. - Him. - I made a bit of a mistake here. Well now I think, why did I make a mistake. Now I'll tell you. I went to the deputy head of running the city of Kyiv Opanasenko. I think that Opanasenko, I think that the group, it's closed. So Opanasenko through his to get to the bottom of what kind of machine this is and wrote Potobenko, that is, a complaint. - Who, Opanasenko? - No, Gongadze.- And here he gives the numbers that were destroyed a year ago. I am changing the plan here a little because... I want to get rid of that Opanasenko. My doubts were over when they reported to me all the way in Kirgizia (?) that Opanasenko is interested in the numbers so I said wait, , so that it... with the numbers I'll do it. I simply, so that it, I mean, so that it doesn't work out anywhere. Well, He'll be here tomorrow. He'll sign that this could be like a settlement for such matters. - Well, so that it doesn't go, because they are throwing dirt into Russia through the Internet. You know, into the Internet through Russia. - Clear. - I'm not letting Gongadze out. Simply for us a question has arisen I also it... Are there indeed already contacts... And there were... armed surveillance I want to study up on his contacts. What it... - To know if there isn't a team there. They named some kind of surnames there. They're scribbling this trash - There are three of them. - We have them. We have them all. - Well I want to start with him. Well and this... the general (prosecutor's office) will react. There are no numbers, I don't know. - And what connection the General (Prosecutor's Office) to Gongadze? - Well their declaration is there. This is official. - well, and so what - the declaration is official. - Well why does every sh** have to write to the general prosecutor, - Leonid Danylovych... - There you go just send it to the rayon prosecutor. - I don't know what the prosecutor there will say. This is the prosecutor... - I bid you all the best. Episode 5 - Well, Leonid Danylovych, what's new? - About Gongadze - ... Episode 6- How should I tell you... Kravchenko promised to take care of it - How should I tell you (undecipherable) The Georgian embassy made an official announcement and made an anonymous call which was in the embassy that the Moscow rayon needs to be searched and Volkov is dealing with this matter, Kravchenko and... one can't place politics... undermine it... in order to undermine... this is also not tolerable... - The ambassador has to be summoned - Me too... and make some kind of notation or warning, or have a conversation. - A call has to be made... and get rid of him to hell this kind of ambassador, blin. - (on the phone) Koval, you need to be removed. Were you taking care of things there with the Georgian embassy? - (answer) We will now start taking care of things - And get him here, blya, Let him make a reply, otherwise I'll call Shevarnadze to call him back the hell with him. - Okay- And say, that I'll call Shevarnadze, to take him out the hell with him. - okay, okay, I'm calling on him right now. Episode 7 - Listen, now they just showed me newspapers, blyat, all these, blyat, that are published. Well, Hrysha Omelchenko is continuing to put out a paper in Kremenchug (pause) Well, what are you bullsh**ing. Eh no, right now the 15th of September he put out a paper. (pause) And I'm telling you, September 15 put out a fresh newspaper. Svoboda (newpaper) blya, is being published, and you're still about that again... Well there, well there, there are such caricatures there, and also insults, blya totally on the president. (pause) So then you invite Yulia. F*** your mother, you invite Yulia, and ask: "dear one, what are you bitch blya doing? Do you want for us to blya you blya completely or what." And say: "why are you financing Omelchenko, why are you doing that-that." You don'y know the method of your job or what, how that's done all over the world. So if they aren't one f***ing bit afraid of you. F*** your mother, well why are you this way. Why should you be feared? It is our service that they are afraid of. ... It was I who appointed you. So that's why let's go. Episode 8 - Listening. And where are you looking. In Poltava oblast in Kremenchug this bastard Omelchenko is publishing such a newspaper, blya, simply incredible. With caricatures, blya, they're throwing dirt on the president with their publications. So therefore, the security service and the prosecutor can't start a criminal case together. So there, these lawyers looked at this, and say that there are grounds to start such a case. Where's the Service. Well yes then why aren't they reporting now. They bring me this newspaper... Newspapers, blya they deliver to me here, while the service doesn't report one f***ing thing. (pause) And that's what's the most interesting. I'll look who participates there, in this same. All these anti-presidential correspondents. ... Yeh, and that includes Korobova of Grani. F*** your mother, imagine, this bitch, blya, this prostitute (who?) of newspapers into which he took her. ... That Gongadze, blya, good-bye-good riddance. - It's time with them all... - The level of influence of the Verkhovna Rada is 4 percent, the level of influence of the Cabinet of Ministers or the premier 0... - On mass media? - Well yeh. - Understand, which it is counting on so that God forbid a finger isn't pointed at it - ... - Well, of course. - ... Episode 11 - Leonid Danilovych, I want to report. I think, that I wrestled out all of his structures competely, yes. And now the team is muffling the matter. Meaning everything, it seems, we took out which is his. - The fund Zlahoda, yeh? - everything is there, everything. I looked there. - Well an aside from the newspaper Toavarish they also have this new newspaper? - Leonid Danylovych, well, we will have all the structures. Well, and now that gang, that distributed leaflets from Holovaty? - Yeh. - Meaning, the day before yesterday he ended up all the way in Sumy oblast, the one that distributed. And they gave it to him there in such a way (laugher). And he yells: "It was Holovaty that me " (laugher) And he came home, and there, meaning, the dacha was occupied, and the door burned - Whose? - His (both laughing) Understood. - ... - And he distributed one or.... - We him... the sh** came out again with a new packet. That same day 15 cops... And he was with 3 guards. Later he came out without anybody, they put him in a car. When they went forward... "I won't anymore, this is Holovaty. Who's your chief? Who's your chief? I'll be a witness. Well, to keep it short... - ... (undecipherable) I have such a subdivision, their methods, they have no moral principles, they have nothing. So that God forbid... So meaning they have nothing. So that simply means me. I have a group and they're beginning to muffle. Well I with your permission will then talk things over with Azarov. - I have an example, that I should also participate. - Azarov also has an example. - Well, something could get mixed up for us. But we are continuing to work. - Is it interesting with them? - What could they have interesting there... Editor's note: English-language grammatical accuracy has been sacrificed in this translation in order to attempt to get across the tone of the original conversation. ========================================= тенограма аудіозапису, який був отриманий О. Морозом від офіцера СБУ Читай англійською Епізод 1 Кучма (Розмовляє через переговорний пристрій з Литвином). Добрий день. Литвин - Добрий день. Кучма- І ти мені давай це саме, по "Українській Правді" ... (фраза нерозбірливо). Та будем вирішувати, шо з ним робити. Він просто абарзєл же ж. Литвин - Мені справу потрібно. Кучма- Га? Литвин - Справу затребувати? ... (нерозбірливо) Кучма- Хорошо. Литвин - Справу ... дєлаєм прямо в копії. Кучма- Ні, мені справа не потрібна... (веде розмову з невідомим чоловіком) - "Українська Правда", ну це просто вже, бля, оборзєлі. Подонок, бля. Грузін, грузін. Невідомий - Гонгадзе? Кучма- Гонгадзе. Ну, кто же его фінансіруєт?... Невідомий- Ну, він активно співпрацює з цим, з Морозом, з "Гранями". Я в суботу його ... з Матвієнко. Кучма- В суд може, тут нардеп, хай би юристи подали в суд. Це ж до прокуратури, да? Невідомий- Нєт, пусть Кравченко скажет на мєня и єщьо на (незрозуміле слово - Горбанєєва чи Компанєєва ) і Халандовіча. Кучма- Просто, бля ... есть какая-то, сука, бля ... Департіровать його, блять, в Грузію і викінуть там на хуй. Невідомий- Отвєзті єго в Грузію і кінуть там. Кучма - Чєчєнцев надо, чтоби укралі єго і викінулі. Епізод 2 Кравченко- Я, щось прізвище таке... Кучма- Ну, подонок, бля висшей мєри. Кравченко- Гонгадзе. Він у нас уже десь проходив... Кучма- Га? Кравченко- Він проходив десь. Пошукаємо. Кучма- Значить, те шо він пише весь час у якусь "Українську ж там правду", її в Інтернет шурує, розумієш? Ну хто його? Фінансує хтось. Кравченко - (нерозбірливо). У мене люди ... (нерозбірливо, можливо, контрозвідка?) Кучма - А головне треба його, я кажу, на зразок, так Володя каже, треба шоб чеченці його вкрали і вивезли його в Чечню на хуй і викуп попросили. Кравченко - Та ми його десь ... я вам скажу... Та це такі люди (сміється) капітальні ... (нерозбірливо), не розтрощив ніде. Кучма - Ну, а його в Грузію відвезти і та й все. Кравченко - Значить, по-перше, доручення чи будем давати, не доручення, по цьому начальнику райвідділу..., ну, пам'ятаєте, що в Чернігівській області казав: "Хай вам президент плате". Кучма- Да-да-да. Кравченко - Заступника уже опустили, так. На нього порушили кримінальну справу. Значить по 165-й, це службові порушення, так 187-а. Так, що я думаю, що десь, на цій неділі ми йому покажемо. Кучма - Да-да. Хай. Кравченко - Теж покажемо, кому що говорити. Епізод 3 Кучма- Під Гонгадзем є окрім того, що він співпрацює з Морозом, він же для Мороза там пише в його "Грані" ці з самого літку, що його фінансує Бродський. Кравченко- Ну, це така скотина, що може бути. Я не здивуюсь, якщо у них там є з соціалістами зв'язки там... Ну ми з ним розберемось. Я думаю, що це ... єсть. Кучма- А Бродський це ж Медведчук і Суркіс? Через Суркіса. Кравченко- Це те, що в них зв'язок єсть, це ж... Кучма- Ні, так щас вони друзі, стовідсотково! Я ж пам'ятаю цю гру біля "Киевских ведомостей" Суркіс, да я на цього, блядь, жида, блядь ... добра. А щас я почитал там кілька тіх самих розмов їхніх. Кравченко- Та ну, він же їх і ставить. В них була тоді така методика. Та вона й залишається. Вони створюють там проблему, потім вродє як ідуть до людини, допомогають, а потім получається, що людина стає залежна. І оце таким чином вона десь... Це великий спектакль на такій почві, мабуть, національній розігрували. І воно попадалося. Ну, це таке діло... Ну, оце, мабуть ... Епізод 4 Кучма- Я хотів попросити вас про от таку форму. Ну, використать, щоб я не забув. Гонгадзе цей. Кравченко - А я, ми працюємо по ньому. Значить ... Кучма- Я ж кажу, вивезіть його, викиньте. Оддайте чеченцам. (нерозбірливо), а тоді викуп. Кравченко- Ми продумаємо. Ми сдєлаєм так, чтоб. Кучма - Значить вивезти його, роздягнуть, бля, без штанів оставить, хай сидить. Я б зробив просто, бля... Кравченко - Сьогодні мені доповідали. Ми там дєлаєм трошки, трошки треба вивчити, ми зробимо. В мене зараз команда боєвая, орли такіє, що делают все, что хочеш. Значіт вот такая сітуація. Литвин - Щось я не зрозумів, по Гонгадзе ви промовчуєте? Кравченко- Відверто. Ну, я вам доповідаю. Там ми трохи прокололися. Кучма - Там у нього команда, во главе якої стоїть прізвище там мені сказали, бля. Кравченко - Значить, написав жалобу Генеральному прокурору. Ну, я думаю... Кучма- Хто? Кравченко - Він. Трошки я тут проколовся. Ну, я тепер думаю, почєму прокололся. Щас доповідаю. Я вийшов на замначальника по оператівной города Кієва Опанасенко. Думаю, что Опанасєнко будєт нам, і что тєпєрь ... група била закрита. То Опанасєнко черєз своїх почал пробивать шо це за машіни і напісав Потебеньку, значить, жалобу. Кучма- Хто? Опанасєнко? Кравченко- Нє, Гонгадзе. Ну, тут он указиваєт номера, які унічтожени год назад. Я трошки тут тактіку мєняю, потому, что... Я хочу убрать етого Опанасєнко. У мене закрался сумнів, коли мені доповіли аж туда в Кіргізію, що Опанасєнко інтересується номерами, то я сказав: підождіть, щоб оно ... Прієзжаю, когда жалоба єсть. Так что... я єго сдєлаю. Я сдєлаю, Леонід Даніловіч. Я просто, щоб воно значить, шоб воно ніде не получилось. Ну, він буде жаловаться. Він тут пише, що це може буть как расчьот на мої справи. Та таке. Кучма- Ну, тут якого бруду вони кидають в Росію через Інтернет. Ну, в Інтернет через Росію. Ясно. Кравченко- Я Гонгадзе не випускаю. Просто для мене тепер питання теж воно ... Я там екіпажі ... єсть контакти ... Я туда кінул наружного наблюдєнія. Я хочу єго контакти подізучіть. Шо воно... Кучма- А Гонгадзе єсть команда? Казали якісь там прізвища. Це строчать цей бруд. Їх три чєловєка. Кравченко- У мєня єсть оні. У мєня всє оні єсть. Ну, я хочу з нього почати. Ну, оце, я хочу подивитися, як Генеральна відреагує. Номерів немає, там, чи я знаю. Ну, він тут пише ..., що це може. Кучма- Ну, а при чєм тут Генеральна до Гонгадзе? Кравченко- Ну є їхня заява. Це ж офійціно. Кучма- Ну і шо? Кравченко- Заява ж офіційна. Ну я подивлюся як вони будуть теж. Кучма- Ну чого кажда срань должна писать на Генерального прокурора? Кравченко- Леонід Данилович... Кучма- Вон отправіть на районного прокурора Кравченко- Я ж не знаю, що прокуратура там скаже. Це ж прокуратура... Хто в кого гроші ... (сміються). Я бажаю всього найкращого. Кучма- Спасіба. Епізод 5 Кравченко- Ну, Леонід Данілович, шо нового, значить... Кучма- Гонгадзе как? Кравченко - Точно так же ... (нерозбірливо). Ми сьогодні там ... видивились. КучмаЗа Головатим дивляться? Кравченко - Та дивляться. Найшли його дві связі. За ним слєдім. Я хочу його хлопнуть на ... етіх. Я хочу єго просто в наглую хлопнуть. Я подброшу самую хорошую блядь. Потом... я сніму еті. Я думаю - не дьорнєтся. (нерозбірливо). Просто відєть ето одне, а так, щоб... Все те, шо доручено, все працює. Ну, я думаю, в тєчєніє Гонгадзе пару днєй. Там буде видєржано, як получиться, одному режисьору... Я там подивився його матеріали з Інтернету повитягувані. Єсть такий Єлісєє [Brat 3: University of Pennsylvania I] |
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08-Feb-2001 11:53 PM |
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rostyk |
What concerns...
6. Plivka Moroza ye pravdyvoyu, a prokuratura, vin i co. tse ne vyznavaly.. My fault. Gen.prokuratura recognized that recordings are authentic. And, if to believe Golovatyi after his talk to president, "he" approved that fact as well. + Potebenko on vacations. People are dying. Ukraine is happy. Let's sing our songs, speak how important we are (so noone considers us and Poland cares about us more than we do), how abundant in resources we are (so schemes in energy sectors put all the villages in the total darkness) and let's vote for the first best who guarantees us peace, independence, blue-and-yellow flag ( etc.) and welfare in Europe on completely NO grounds. [Brat 3: University of Pennsylvania I] |
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09-Feb-2001 12:10 AM |
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Tarasishe |
YA OSHALEVAYU!!!!!
http://www.pravda.com.ua/?0121-3-8 [Brat 3: University of Pennsylvania I] |
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09-Feb-2001 12:23 AM |
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musliba |
a meni s'ogodni moya kyivs'ka roommateka napysala, i meni zdayet'sya scho spravdi bagac'ko z togo scho nam rozpovidayut' ye kazochky. i sche vona skazala, cituyu:
"6-go lutogo v Kyieve vidnovylasia akciya "UKRAINA BEZ KUCHMY", ya bula na Khreshatyku, specialno na pary ne pishla. te, sho tam bulo, vrazylo mene do glybyny dushi: i za Kuchmu, i proty ludy vystupaly ne za pereconannia. vsim bulo zaplocheno." i ce na moyu dumku cilkom real'no. ya vvajayu scho bil'shist' tyx lyudei scho pishly v kyiv z usiyeyi ukrayiny ishly spravdi proty kuchmy, ale cya sytuaciya v politychnyx kolax prosto bisyt'. [Brat 3: University of Pennsylvania I] |
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09-Feb-2001 03:41 AM |
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Neo |
bez bazara...
za kuchmu vsem libo platili libo admin metodami gnali... naprimer - novoyavlenue monarhistu - kursantu MVS... plyus - ya gdeto chital shto studentam platili po 20 grv shtobu oni shli na mitingi za Kuchmu... nu i koneshno, siloy vseh vuganyali... naprimer v Krumu sognali okolo 10.000 "pro-kuchmovcev"... ne poydesh - s univera, rabotu vugonyat... Andy [Brat 3: University of Pennsylvania I] |
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09-Feb-2001 04:15 AM |
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ivan |
Zdorovo, rebyata!!!
VY j vrode presentation po svobode slova v Ukraine gotovili??? Prishlitr pojaluysta REsearch project i Presentation file VSE prochitau... Interesno znat' chem jyvem ;-) 2dasend@usa.net S blagodarnost'u, Ivan (Political Science) [Brat 3: University of Pennsylvania I] |
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